Challenge: Religiosity correlates positively to conservatism

[Baruch]

Same rules as before, but I want EH and Kurt to go head to head and I get to watch. It is EH's turn.

Shalom

[evangelicalhumanist]

Well, I'd be game, except I rather suspect that Kurt and I would be on the same side. Of course, there's always the game of trying to argue for the other side (just to practice the art of debate, of course)...

[Baruch]

I would love to see both of you, argue for opposite your own position, just as I had to, on principle I not really an aniconic puritan.

Shalom

[evangelicalhumanist]

I would love to see both of you, argue for opposite your own position, just as I had to, on principle I not really an aniconic puritan.

Shalom

That sort of argument is a lovely sort of sophist exercise, but it sheds -- in the end -- little real light on the issues and concerns of human life. My own preference (as I think you know by now, since we've actually known each other online for more than 4 years!) is to argue and explore, sometimes passionately, those things that I care about.

It's an odd thing to say, but at 62, I'm hoping to be around for a time yet, but as I haven't contributed much to the world, I think it's unlikely that I'll suddenly "blossom" and contribute some earth-shattering understanding that makes everything suddenly bearable. That's a little disappointing, really, but there it is. Still, I think the best value any of us can ultimately add beyond those immediately affected by our actions is to make cogent, compelling arguments for the common good of all humanity. (He said, as if he knew what that might look like. )

[Baruch]

That was a very noble thing to say. There may be hope still, for a few of the more advanced simians. OK, if you want to be pro ... then Kurt has to volunteer to be anti.

Shalom

[Kurt]

Interesting idea...As EH suggests, my natural inclination would be to argue for the thesis, but there are a few reasons why I might be willing to argue against it. Firstly, I would have a very direct opportunity to try and match EH's systematic debating rigour. Secondly, I have an inkling about the approach I might take. Thirdly, it never hurts one to try to imagine why and how someone might arrive at a conclusion that is centrally diferent from one's natural inclinations.

Let me think on it for a day or two.

Kurt

[evangelicalhumanist]

Oh, c'mon Kurt. It'll be good practice. It'll teach you, if nothing else, to argue what you don't believe (this is called "lying" in other contexts) convincingly. Should you ever do something of which you are less than proud, that might just come in handy.

[Kurt]

Okay. As the inimitable Britney Spears was wont to sing, Hit me with your best shot!

EH, if you have specific ideas about how you want to structure the debate, I'm all ears. The last set-up seemed okay to me, but I'm open to variations on that theme.

Kurt

[evangelicalhumanist]

Okey-dokey, then.

However, I don't know that we need to stay with the prior format, even with Baruch's invocation that we do. Let's shake it up a bit (if you agree), and try a simple back and forth for 4 rounds (4 each, or 8 posts in total). Debates can get tedious if there's too much time between posts, so I would suggest a 3-day limit (with grace given for a prior notification in this challenge thread for one side of the other who must be away for a period of time). That means that a post on the 12th (at whatever time of day) must be followed by one on the 16th, at whatever time of day -- unless prior notice is given. Agreed?

Length? I'm happy to suggest a maximum length of approximately 1000 words per post (MS-Word can help you count, I'll teach you how if you need).

Direct quotes and statistics must be sourced.

How do you feel about those?

If you are agreed, I will need a couple of days to get started. I haven't actually thought out what my approach might be yet.

[Kurt]

Copacetic on all counts. I use word count in Word, where I will be vetting my entries for spelling, grammar, etc, as I did for my debate with Baruch, so the 1000 word maximum will be fine. I like the straightforward four entries each approach, too.

You go first, right?

Anything else?

Kurt